BlahBlahCafe - Jean-Michel Jarre forum

A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

Jakob BC wrote:A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

You have right. It is in Izrael .

Vieon wrote:So you're telling me that the 1000+ civilian casualties in Lebanon and the deliberate shelling of a UN outpost was deserved?

And you're telling me that you don't think Palestine should exist, because of religious reasons? After all, the only reason that the Arabs in your area are not in a seperate state of their own is because you took the land from them and won't allow them to have their state.

LOL
So you're telling me that the it's ok to sends 4000 rockets towrds Israel from civilians population in lebanon.

so you're telling me that the it's ok to sends 4000 rockets towrds Israel from UN outposts
(BTW ISRAEL NEVER HIT DEILBARETLY UN OUTPOST --- STOP LYING!

"you don't think Palestine should exist, because of religious"

NO,I NEVER SAY THAT. I AND THE ISRAELI GOVERNMANT SUPPORT THE 2 STATE SOLUTION. THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE "GOVERNMANT " OF PALESTINE (HAMAS)
DON'T WANT TO RECOGDNIZE ISRAEL!.


"you took the land from them"
no. they took the land from us. read history!


P.S
Israel warned parts of Beirut by dropping flyers telling the local population to stay away from the Hezbollah headquarters in the district.
DID HIZBULLAH ALSO WARNED THE ISEARLI POPULATION

Jakob BC wrote:A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

NO It's under Palestinian Authority!

TelAviv909 wrote:

Jakob BC wrote:A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

NO It's under Palestinian Authority!

...Really??...Hm. Sorry.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

Hang on - it wasn't a deliberate shelling? So even after 10 messages to stop shelling were sent to the Israeli artillery commanders, they continued and it wasn't deliberate? So they're either lying or incompetant.

No, I don't think that sending rockets toward Israel was right. But then again, I don't think you are any better for the terribly destructive response you sent them. If you had maintained a peaceful solution to the conflict, like Britain did when Iran took our soldiers then maybe the world would have a lot more respect for your country.

And thats fair enough if you believe in a 2 state solution, I do too. But you have to respect the right of the Palestinians to pick their own government, you can't just step in and say that they can't have the government that they voted for just because Israel doesn't like it.

And don't you dare call me a liar again. I am voicing my own opinion just as much as you have the right to voice yours, but do NOT insult me. Final warning.

TelAviv909 wrote:"Show me this hate you describe. Quote him. I don't see any of it."

"afterall the foundation of an "unsecular jewish state" is a mistake according to many, including me"

just to be absolutely clear....

"afterall the foundation of an "unsecular jewish state" is a mistake according to many, including me"

With that I mean that a country where your religion decides if you can be part of society is moraly wrong....

This doesn't mean that I don't think jews shouldn't have a safe place to live AT ALL, but it also doesn't mean they can STEAL land and occupie it and throw non-jews out (millions have been kicked out)

All it means is that israel would be a better place if ALL people living there have equel rights

WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM WITH THAT CONCEPT DUDE?

I'm getting sick and tired of being called "anti-semite" when all I do is look at the facts I see, the data I collect and comment about it. No jew is better (or worse) then any other human being, we are all equel and it's time jews start looking at what they're doing to palastinian PPL in their home country.

When you point a finger at someone else there's three fingers pointing back you know...

According to you it's OK to kill 1500 lebanese PPL (1191 of them civilians) because the hezbolah fired some rockets into a desert hoping to hit a israeli militairy positions? (killing 43 israeli PLL)

It's OK to send an army of 10.000 to catch 500-600 hezbolah fighters?

Nevermind the UN, let's just bomb their posts so they can't get in the way of fighting (killing 50 UN officials along the way...) (typo fixed, 50 is the approxamite number of UN officials killed in the confict BTW, most of lebanese nationality)

The only reason the second intifada started was because Israel was refusing to implement the oslo agreement, the palastinian authorities DID support the 2 state solution INCLUDING acceping israel, they were forced to denounce it however after camp david failed...

Statistics also don't lie

casualties

first intifada (1993-1997)
israel 160 (5 childresn)
palastine 1162 (241 children)

al aqsa intifada (2000-present)
israel 1023 (no children(!)
palastine 4160 (784 children)


Who is the victim in this confict, and who is the agressor?

both sides ofcourse, but somehow the statistics don't show the same picture...












where is the balance in that?

Israel is essentially land that was forcibly taken from the Arabs and given to the Jews for no particular reason. They have a right to be angry

Ehm, Dude, I wouldn't dare using the words "no particular reason", it was 1948 remember... I'd say jews had a VERY GOOD REASON to want a safe place...

Pretty much agree with the Goonmeister above. All I see over there are (and this is not a personal attack) crazy religious zealots on BOTH sides, all vying for the same piece of land. Israel has no more right to the area than the Arabs, and the way that the Arabs are systematically persecuted in the area disgusts me.

TelAviv909 wrote:

Jakob BC wrote:A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

NO It's under Palestinian Authority!

Sorry but you don't have to yell. I was just curious as Betlehem is an important place within Cristianity but I have never read Palestine anywehere in the Bible.

Jakob BC wrote:

TelAviv909 wrote:

Jakob BC wrote:A little off-topic but isn't Betlehem a part of Israel?

NO It's under Palestinian Authority!

Sorry but you don't have to yell. I was just curious as Betlehem is an important place within Cristianity but I have never read Palestine anywehere in the Bible.

i'm not yell at you!
you are right there is no Palestine in the bible

Finaero wrote:You're walking on a very thin line here, TelAviv. Let's turn this conversation civil now.

Sorry Finaero it won't happen again.
it was a mistake to argue with them.

Indeed! I think he has already used enough strong words towards the other users by now and it looks like it can only get worse. I don't know if it means "lock the thread" or something else.

Watch your language TelAviv909!

TelAviv909 wrote:

Finaero wrote:You're walking on a very thin line here, TelAviv. Let's turn this conversation civil now.

Sorry Finaero it won't happen again.
it was a mistake to argue with them.

IT IS NEVER A MISTAKE TO ARGUE!

But keep it civil, no namecalling etc, but also be constructive.

And who is "them"?

TelAviv909 wrote:DON'T WORRY
I'M DONE TALKING WITH YOU!

Why exactly?

Ran out of arguements?

Be constructive here TelAviv, what is your solution then?